Mindful Walking for Calm & Clarity | ANEW Ep. 22

Take a walk with us—mindfully.

In Episode 22 of the ANEW Insight Podcast, I sit down with mindfulness expert and award-winning author Donald Altman to explore how something as simple as walking can become a powerful tool for reducing stress, improving focus, and restoring emotional balance.

Donald shares moving personal stories and practical tips on how mindful walking can transform your daily routine—even if you only have a few minutes to spare. We break down what mindfulness really means, how to start walking with awareness, and why this practice is so effective for mental health, emotional resilience, and reconnecting with your body.

This episode is perfect if you:

• Feel burned out or scattered and want to reset
• Struggle to meditate but crave calm and clarity
• Want to incorporate mindfulness into everyday life without overhauling your schedule

Whether you’re new to mindfulness or a longtime practitioner, Donald’s wisdom will leave you feeling grounded, inspired, and ready to reclaim peace—one step at a time.

🎙️ Listen now and discover how to turn every walk into a path back to yourself.
 🔗 Visit anew-insight.com/podcast to learn more.

For more about Donald Altman  and his work, visit his website https://mindfulpractices.com/ and follow him on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/mndfulpractices/ Facebook at https://www.facebook.com/MndfulPractices/ LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/donald-altman-m-a-lpc-50a01125/  Youtube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJUHHD1Sw0hjcSBG6jZppzw 

#mindfulwalking #donaldaltman #mindfulnesspractice #walkingmeditation #mentalwellness #stressrelieftips #emotionalhealthmatters #selfcareeveryday #anewbodyinsight #mindfulmovement #meditationtools #holistichealth #anewinsightpodcast #podcastforhealing #mentalclarityjourney

Thank you for joining us on this journey to wellness. Remember, the insights and advice shared on the ANEW Body Insight Podcast are for educational and informational purposes only and do not constitute medical advice. Always consult with a healthcare professional before making any changes to your health routine. To learn more about the podcast and stay updated on new episodes, visit ANEW Body Insight Podcast at anew-insight.com. To watch this episode on YouTube, visit @my.anew.insight. Follow us on social media at @my.anew.insight on Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, and Threads for more updates and insights. Thank you for tuning in! Stay connected with us for more empowering stories and expert guidance. Until next time, stay well and keep evolving with ANEW Body Insight!

Transcript

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Welcome to the ANEW Body Insight podcast,


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empowering and inspiring your journey to optimal health.


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Hosted by Dr. Supatra Tovar, clinical psychologist,


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registered dietitian, fitness expert and author of Deprogram Diet Culture:


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Rethink Your Relationship with Food, Heal Your Mind and Live a Diet-Free Life,


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and Chantal Donnelly, physical therapist and author of Settled:


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How to Find Calm in a Stress Inducing world.


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We follow our guests’ journey to optimal health,


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providing you with the keys to unlock your own wellness path.


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Tune in and evolve with us.


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Welcome
back to the ANEW Body Insight podcast.


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We are back for the second half
of our amazing interview


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with mindfulness Guru and expert
Donald Altman.


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He gave us some really powerful background
about his transition


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from a hectic and unfulfilling life
to becoming a Buddhist monk


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in the hills of San Bernardino,
and how he transitioned


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into the eating disorder world,
especially as a counselor,


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and became this internationally known
mindfulness expert.


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We are so excited to learn more.


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Welcome back, Donald.


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Oh thanks. Supatra.


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Great to be here.


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Yay! We're so excited.


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So you went into the eating disorder,
treatment world work there


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for a long time.


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Work with Jean Castello, who's amazing.


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Tell us about how all of this transitioned
for you


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into teaching and and
and conducting workshops.


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Tell us about that kind of transition
for you.


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Yeah. It's interesting.


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I again, it's it's just something
I probably never could have.


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predicted.


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it was one of my teachers
at Lewis and Clark who had done some works


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for a workshop, had, done
some trainings in a workshop company,


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and she asked if I was interested
in doing that kind of thing.


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I guess they were looking for some people,


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and I thought,
oh, yeah, I'd love to try that.


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And so I, created a mindful
eating workshop.


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That was the first workshop
I did on the road.


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And, so I go
I had to go out for three days


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in different cities,
and I really loved it.


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I found that people love doing the mindful
eating practices, and


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I would have them, eat a raisin
using what I call the


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the S.T.O.P. method, which is select,


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taste, observe and then pause.


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Yeah. Yeah.


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And and they were shocked that we did
a raisin in 20 minutes.


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One raisin.


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And then I sometimes I say
well should we do another raisin.


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And people would say
nah I'm too I'm too full now.


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I couldn't


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too much.


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Raisin.


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Too much.


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Well there were so they were fulfilled
as a, as a as opposed to just filled up.


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Right. Exactly.


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So yeah, it was,
and then I expanded into more


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broader
mindfulness and wrote a book that was,


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The Mindfulness Toolbox,
which turned out to be


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a bestselling book in the psychology
field.


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And, so I made that into a workshop, and
I did, one, two and three day trainings.


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The three day trainings were great because
I was actually getting time to teach people.


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You know, a lot of these practices
in


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a more deeper, sustainable way.


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So they'd get to learn how do they work
with partners and how they get to,


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you know, teach a partner or they, they,


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they got to really experience mindfulness.


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And, I mean, I had some people come up
to me, we would do mindful walking.


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We would do mindful eating.


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The breathwork, other, face to face work


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that I would have them do
for compassion, for example.


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And I mean,
I at times had people come up to me


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after workshop with, with tears saying,
you know, that


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they were so moved by the experience
and that that's made it for me, that made


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made it all worthwhile getting on the road
and traveling around.


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If you could touch somebody's life
in that way.


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And, these were also
these are mostly psychotherapists. So.


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And they were touched by this
at that level.


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So, and for them to be able to then
bring that


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to their clients for depression or anxiety
or whatever, it meant a lot to me.


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but, I remember one time


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there was, we were doing mindful walking,
and there was a lady who came up


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after the exercise into tears in her eyes
and she said, I,


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I grew up with her
brain wasn't wired wired.


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She said I had no sense of proprioception,


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which was the ability
to know where your body is in space.


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So if you close your eyes, she said,
I would just fall over, she said.


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But something happened
when I was doing this walk


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and I had them start by,
by by moving near a wall so they could.


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Because if you're moving slowly
and you haven't done it,


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you could lose your balance
a little bit. So,


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at the end of the practice,


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you know, we did 20 minutes


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and a little more than that
actually a second time.


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And she said, I


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something must have happened, my brain,


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because I closed my eyes
and I could do this.


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Wow. For the first.


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Yeah, it was amazing.


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And I. Wonder
what was blocking her before.


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I. Yeah, I don't know, I don't know.


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And it would sometimes
and I would show some videos of people


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doing amazing things
with balance and presence.


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There was a lady who had these,


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I wish I could remember.


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She used to be with, Cirque
du Soleil, I heard


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And she was on
some one of these, star shows


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where you do some of,
you know, something, very unique.


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And so she had all these long,
like bamboo,


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really intricately shaped pieces of wood,
I guess.


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And she stacked them
and balanced them one on another.


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Then she would put them on her head
and they were balanced.


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But if she lost focus for even a,


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you know, a 10th of a second, it'd
probably all fall down.


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What she was able to do.


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And so I showed that to the group first,
and they were shocked


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that somebody, you know,
because we moved so quickly, I had people


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when I would be we'd be doing this mindful
walking in hotels or outside hotels.


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I had people at the front desk
running up to me, asking me, asking


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me if I was okay.


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Because I was moving so slowly. I am just present!


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Oh my God, is having a stroke.


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You know, I.


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Know this is just what the


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present moment looks like.


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I'm fine, I'm fine.


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That's awesome.


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Oh, it was, Yeah.


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So that's kind of how I.


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I moved into that,
and I did that for many years.


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And at some point
I was balancing having a private practice


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with doing the the road work
and writing books,


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and, finally, decided to make the shift


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to all of the training,
which I did after many years.


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it's a little hard.


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A little too hard to do
both after a while, but.


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I can attest to that right now.


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It's like.


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It's like you're juggling
two different careers. almost


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Yeah, it's if you don't really,


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you know, practice self-care
and you're traveling all the time,


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and that can really take it out on, of you
and how how can you


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transition back into therapy?


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It's it's very difficult. So, yeah.


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It was a challenging.


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Well,
I think, you know, you you've been called


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to give this message
on a wider scale then, I mean, it's


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wonderful to do it one on one,
but you have reached so many people.


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I want to hear about the movie.


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I have not seen this movie.


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And I want to know how
we can all see this.


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And, just tell us how
you got involved in it and,


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how did it contribute to the broader


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Yeah, understanding of mindfulness?


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I think this movie really
it was called The Mindfulness Movie.


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And it was, it was on Netflix.


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I'm not sure if it's on Netflix anymore,


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but you can go to themindfulnessmovie.com website, and I'm


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sure that's where you can get a copy
or find out how to stream it.


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Okay. And,


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Paul Harrison, who's a Zen,


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student and really like a Zen master,


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who's also an architect
and fascinating background.


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And he decided
he wanted to make this movie.


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And so he's the host,
and he does a fantastic job.


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I mean, in the beginning of the movie


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and there's different segments,
and there was a segment on neuroscience


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and mindfulness
segment on schools and mindfulness,


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segment on, the military and mindfulness.


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stress and mindfulness.


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So it's got all these great elements.


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But then I remember the movie starts, he's
walking around the streets,


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and he was living in,
the Los Angeles area at the time.


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And so he's part of,
I think he went up to Universal


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Studios or, you know, in Studio City
or somewhere like that.


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And he's got his microphone.


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He's saying,
we're doing a documentary on mindfulness.


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Do you know anything about mindfulness?


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It was surprising
how many people were like,


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no, I don't know anything about
what is it?


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And, so that's how the movie started.


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But then he gets into really bringing
in a lot of experts.


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And I was feel
honored to be part of that group.


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turned out the,


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Jeffrey Schwartz,
who wrote the book Brain Lock and,


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had the same mindfulness teacher as me
U Silananda.


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I met Jeff when I met him, Jeffrey
one time we became friends, and.


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But he,


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he also consulted with Leonardo DiCaprio
on the Howard Hughes movie.


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yeah. Yeah.


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So that was kind of Jeffrey
Schwartz's history, but he referred me


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to Paul Harrison, and,


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and Paul came up here to Portland
and where I'm living and,


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interviewed me there for the movie, but
I think the movie made a huge difference.


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I've shown it in clips and,


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you know, for the breathing part
and the stress part,


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he brings a lot of science in.


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And then especially the neuroscience
of how mindfulness rewires the brain.


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Totally. And it's it's very cool stuff.


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So it's a real,
kind of cutting edge film in that way.


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And it very relevant brings in the work
of Jon Kabat-Zinn and so forth.


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I think that's great.


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I definitely am going to check that out.


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I do think when you do ask people
what mindfulness is, they're like.


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I don't know.


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so it's a really good place
to point them to give them a,


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you know, a really quality piece of work
to show them


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the applications of it,
the benefits of it.


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And I can attest to those benefits.


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I think, you know, I started, practicing
mindfulness and mindfulness meditation


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when I started in my dietetics
program, for nutritional science.


00:11:10:10 - 00:11:11:21
Yeah. Because I was.


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So stressed out because, like,
I was coming


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back into grad school and I'm like,
oh my God, biochemistry.


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And I have to memorize so many things.


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and it has,
I think, fundamentally changed me.


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I used to be very anxious, very wound up,


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I think negative in a lot of ways.


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mind was just all over the place,


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and it really helped me to center me


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and to create more objectivity.


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That's helped me to be able to regulate
my emotions.


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It's made me more compassionate
and empathetic over the years especially.


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It's it's just you see these benefits
and they've documented this.


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This has been proven that. Yeah, really.


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Like the more you practice it,
the more you benefit from it.


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So I'm going to tell


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everybody I'm going to put that
into the little show notes as well.


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Go to themindfulnessmovie.com
and check this out.


00:12:06:10 - 00:12:08:23
I have. It
as. Well. Yeah. No that's great.


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And I've shown it,
I've shown clips to clients.


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I've shown it in groups.


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And it
it really makes an impact on people to


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see that.


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And the other thing about mindfulness is it
kind of normalizes or de-pathologizes us.


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Right. And it normalize it.


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These are the thoughts


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and the feelings that we as humans
that we all have to deal with,


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but it helps us manage and deal with it


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in a much better way than you're ever.


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You're not taught
how to do this in school.


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Unfortunately,
although I have been invited


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and gone to some high schools
and the kids loved it.


00:12:42:05 - 00:12:42:24
Oh, absolutely.


00:12:42:24 - 00:12:46:21
I think kids absolutely love it
and they're probably better at it than


00:12:46:21 - 00:12:48:10
we are.


00:12:48:10 - 00:12:51:10
I don't know why,
but they just really, really,


00:12:51:14 - 00:12:54:24
become attuned to it
and they can just shift their mind.


00:12:55:03 - 00:12:58:00
I think it's
just because there's just so open.


00:12:58:00 - 00:13:02:02
And when when we're open, it's easier
to adopt something new.


00:13:02:19 - 00:13:04:15
and, and to practice something.


00:13:04:15 - 00:13:07:23
And, and for kids, you know,
their attention goes all over the place.


00:13:07:23 - 00:13:10:23
But, you know, having them
focus on one thing


00:13:11:04 - 00:13:14:04
can be really, really powerful for them.


00:13:14:18 - 00:13:19:06
Transitioning out of that, I'm curious how
you got involved with Psychology Today.


00:13:19:06 - 00:13:22:03
You do this practical mindfulness blog.


00:13:22:03 - 00:13:23:05
Tell us about that.


00:13:23:05 - 00:13:25:19
Oh yeah. And,
you know, give us an overview of it.


00:13:25:19 - 00:13:28:19
The blog is


00:13:28:20 - 00:13:32:17
one of my favorite things to do, actually,
because I get to approach,


00:13:33:16 - 00:13:34:06
you know,


00:13:34:06 - 00:13:38:06
in a, in a very short way,
a specific topic.


00:13:38:06 - 00:13:43:14
So I love something unlike the one word
that conquers, dementia,


00:13:43:14 - 00:13:46:14
the one word that which is sleep


00:13:47:08 - 00:13:47:21
Hahaha


00:13:47:21 - 00:13:48:13
I was like, what is it?


00:13:48:13 - 00:13:51:12
Donald? Help!


00:13:51:12 - 00:13:52:00
Okay, good. I sleep.


00:13:52:00 - 00:13:55:10
One word that overcomes, jealousy,
which is Mudita,


00:13:55:24 - 00:13:59:10
which is,
sympathetic joy or appreciative joy.


00:13:59:22 - 00:14:01:03
Right.


00:14:01:03 - 00:14:03:22
And so I'll have these, you know, they,
you know, you have to come up


00:14:03:22 - 00:14:07:12
with a catchy title or something,
but it's all these different ways


00:14:07:12 - 00:14:11:23
that I'm able to really kind of target
in on a topic


00:14:12:04 - 00:14:15:24
and give people a short training
I do in all my work, and I think


00:14:15:24 - 00:14:19:06
maybe that's what's made my work
a little different from some others is,


00:14:19:24 - 00:14:22:12
I'm big on the skills and the training.


00:14:22:12 - 00:14:23:18
And that's the thing about mindfulness.


00:14:23:18 - 00:14:27:19
I could sit and explain mindfulness,
but unless you actually practice it,


00:14:28:06 - 00:14:29:05
it's not going to take.


00:14:29:05 - 00:14:33:01
It's like, you know, I could
pour ajax in a tub, but you have to scrub


00:14:33:01 - 00:14:36:22
or the tubs are going to get cleaned
with the ajax just sitting there.


00:14:36:22 - 00:14:37:20
Right.


00:14:37:20 - 00:14:41:11
And so mindfulness is,
is that, scrubbing agent.


00:14:42:09 - 00:14:44:24
Right. And it polishes things off.


00:14:44:24 - 00:14:47:24
It helps you see it gets through the,


00:14:48:03 - 00:14:51:01
you know, the, the film and the dirt
and everything lets


00:14:51:01 - 00:14:54:23
you see things in a more clear,
direct way, right?


00:14:55:00 - 00:14:57:06
Right
where you don't have to push things away.


00:14:57:06 - 00:14:59:02
You don't have to grab on to things.


00:14:59:02 - 00:15:01:11
You can just see it for what it is.


00:15:01:11 - 00:15:06:03
And and there's a lot of,
liberation in that.


00:15:06:03 - 00:15:07:05
There's a lot of freedom.


00:15:07:05 - 00:15:08:02
And just like, seeing.


00:15:08:02 - 00:15:10:12
Oh, this is the reality of it. Right?


00:15:10:12 - 00:15:13:12
So the energy
I have of trying to avoid something


00:15:13:21 - 00:15:16:23
or trying to grab onto something,
constantly


00:15:16:23 - 00:15:20:00
craving desire or rejection,


00:15:21:02 - 00:15:22:08
it's about attachment.


00:15:22:08 - 00:15:24:04
How do we attach to things?


00:15:24:04 - 00:15:26:07
And mindfulness


00:15:26:07 - 00:15:29:24
really helps you live in a much freer way.


00:15:30:10 - 00:15:31:03
And maybe that's


00:15:31:03 - 00:15:34:15
where you're talking about the kids,
how they're more adaptable or whatever,


00:15:34:18 - 00:15:37:12
but it allows you to live,
I think, less, more flexibly.


00:15:37:12 - 00:15:41:09
You're not attached to your schemas,
your belief systems, your ideas.


00:15:41:09 - 00:15:43:21
So like they're written in stone


00:15:43:21 - 00:15:47:01
and, and and you're able
to make changes in your life.


00:15:47:16 - 00:15:50:16
Yes. Okay. I love that about jealousy.


00:15:50:17 - 00:15:55:06
I think that that's a really,
really great way to reframe


00:15:55:06 - 00:15:58:14
and to look at a situation differently.


00:15:58:14 - 00:16:01:21
We all, I think, are familiar with the Ben
Franklin quote.


00:16:01:21 - 00:16:04:10
That comparison is the thief of joy.


00:16:04:10 - 00:16:06:02
So I really like. the tie into that


00:16:06:02 - 00:16:07:21
Oh yeah.


00:16:07:21 - 00:16:11:23
Tell me what you, I have clients
that struggle with this all the time,


00:16:12:13 - 00:16:16:07
when they're in the beginnings
of the recovery process.


00:16:16:12 - 00:16:18:18
weight restoration and especially.


00:16:18:18 - 00:16:23:11
And there is so much anxiety
about the weight gain,


00:16:24:01 - 00:16:27:01
and they get so fixated on the weight
gain.


00:16:27:10 - 00:16:30:23
What would you give them as a mindfulness
exercise


00:16:30:23 - 00:16:35:20
to help to settle their nervous system
through that process?


00:16:36:13 - 00:16:38:06
Yeah. You know, I would think about,


00:16:40:18 - 00:16:43:08
it's almost like, equanimity,


00:16:43:08 - 00:16:48:08
you know, Mudita which is, it's one of
what is known as the divine, abode


00:16:48:08 - 00:16:51:07
The four


00:16:51:07 - 00:16:54:07
the four divine abodes,


00:16:54:13 - 00:16:58:09
where, if you were enlightened,
these are the things you would strive for.


00:16:58:09 - 00:17:01:11
One would be, which I mentioned Mudita
to sympathy of joy,


00:17:01:17 - 00:17:05:13
which is means having appreciation
for the success of others.


00:17:05:23 - 00:17:07:06
Right.


00:17:07:06 - 00:17:10:03
and if you if it's interesting,
if you have that


00:17:10:03 - 00:17:14:01
it's incompatible
with feelings of jealousy or anger.


00:17:14:11 - 00:17:15:09
All right.


00:17:15:09 - 00:17:19:03
So those it's a very different way
of being present in the world.


00:17:19:17 - 00:17:23:17
And then, Karuna is compassion, right?


00:17:24:02 - 00:17:26:17
Upekkha is,


00:17:26:17 - 00:17:29:15
equanimity, which means realizing


00:17:29:15 - 00:17:32:24
things are always in flux,
always changing.


00:17:33:01 - 00:17:33:09
Right.


00:17:33:09 - 00:17:36:19
This is this is the nature of life.


00:17:36:19 - 00:17:39:06
This is impermanence, right.


00:17:39:06 - 00:17:41:07
And so you could


00:17:42:08 - 00:17:43:05
look around and you


00:17:43:05 - 00:17:46:05
could see the impermanence is everywhere.


00:17:46:05 - 00:17:48:17
You know, we're not the same as we were


00:17:48:17 - 00:17:52:00
as little children,
thank God we were able to grow and evolve.


00:17:52:14 - 00:17:53:12
Right.


00:17:53:12 - 00:17:55:21
And so everything is in flux.


00:17:55:21 - 00:17:59:11
And so it was our our weight
constantly in flux.


00:17:59:11 - 00:18:04:24
And if you could live with, and invite
in equanimity that  upekkha you've become love it.


00:18:05:19 - 00:18:08:17
And also also self love


00:18:08:17 - 00:18:12:16
mehta which is the other
the fourth one is loving kindness.


00:18:12:16 - 00:18:12:23
Right?


00:18:12:23 - 00:18:15:23
We sent it to ourselves first because we,


00:18:16:00 - 00:18:19:00
you know, to help kind of,


00:18:19:20 - 00:18:20:16
because we need it.


00:18:20:16 - 00:18:22:18
We need,


00:18:22:18 - 00:18:24:18
to overcome the pains


00:18:24:18 - 00:18:27:18
and struggles of life. So,


00:18:27:20 - 00:18:31:14
inviting that wish for our own
well-being is so important.


00:18:32:03 - 00:18:35:03
Oh, I feel like I kind of passed the test.


00:18:35:05 - 00:18:38:20
Guess I was dealing with this, actually,
yesterday.


00:18:38:20 - 00:18:40:23
And, you know, I.


00:18:40:23 - 00:18:45:13
I just tried to stress that,
you know, life is not permanent.


00:18:46:03 - 00:18:48:06
change is a inevitable.


00:18:48:06 - 00:18:48:16
Yeah.


00:18:48:16 - 00:18:51:07
This is a temporary state that you're in.


00:18:51:07 - 00:18:55:23
And if you can be kind
and compassionate to yourself and know


00:18:55:23 - 00:19:01:24
that you are on the road to healing,
you can withstand this discomfort.


00:19:02:07 - 00:19:05:24
And just sitting with the discomfort,
but understanding and knowing


00:19:06:04 - 00:19:10:15
that you're doing something, loving
for yourself, that you are deconditioning


00:19:11:00 - 00:19:14:11
really old and unhelpful ways of thinking,


00:19:14:20 - 00:19:19:02
and you are trying to reformulate
something that's more kind and loving,


00:19:19:18 - 00:19:22:14
especially when you regulate
your nervous system.


00:19:22:14 - 00:19:25:11
Your body responds
so much better than if you're


00:19:25:11 - 00:19:28:21
in that heightened, stressed,
anxious state.


00:19:29:14 - 00:19:33:06
And then, you know, understanding
that you can move past that


00:19:33:11 - 00:19:37:15
and then come to a place of peace
with your body.


00:19:37:21 - 00:19:40:03
It may not be where you were before,


00:19:40:03 - 00:19:44:03
when you were essentially emaciated
and having body dysmorphia


00:19:44:20 - 00:19:49:08
and really thinking of yourself as fat
when you were, you know, very, very thin,


00:19:49:17 - 00:19:52:20
you're going to get to that place
where you actually see yourself


00:19:53:06 - 00:19:57:16
more realistically
and more in a healthy fashion.


00:19:58:00 - 00:20:01:00
So I really love that I'm going to


00:20:01:11 - 00:20:04:06
and give me the for.


00:20:04:06 - 00:20:07:14
Well, there's,
Yeah, Mudita sympathy of joy,


00:20:08:13 - 00:20:13:00
upekkha is is the, equanimity.


00:20:13:12 - 00:20:17:08
Karuna is compassion
and Mehta is loving kindness.


00:20:17:08 - 00:20:21:07
So those are the four divine abodes,
as they're often called.


00:20:21:20 - 00:20:24:07
Well, I feel like I'm in class with Donald
Altman.


00:20:24:07 - 00:20:26:02
You guys.


00:20:26:02 - 00:20:27:19
But I love what you said about.


00:20:27:19 - 00:20:30:19
Yeah, I love what you said about,
you know, equanimity,


00:20:32:01 - 00:20:34:00
you know, working with your clients also.


00:20:34:00 - 00:20:37:00
I mean, letting go of that perfectionism,
right?


00:20:37:07 - 00:20:39:17
That's an extreme right.


00:20:39:17 - 00:20:43:24
Having to have it be exactly this way,
or being stuck


00:20:43:24 - 00:20:47:23
in a rigid way of eating or thinking
or viewing your body.


00:20:48:22 - 00:20:52:18
And, so it's,
you know, it's it's it's letting go.


00:20:52:18 - 00:20:53:23
It's surrendering to that.


00:20:53:23 - 00:20:55:09
You know, they had this thing the,


00:20:55:09 - 00:20:58:08
and I wrote about this
in one of my mindfulness blogs.


00:20:58:08 - 00:21:00:23
I called it Escape
the Monkey Trap of Unhappiness.


00:21:00:23 - 00:21:03:23
So, you know,
one of the things I used to do,


00:21:04:19 - 00:21:08:03
or so I've heard to capture
monkeys, was the take a gourd


00:21:08:14 - 00:21:12:17
and hollow it out
and nail it to the ground,


00:21:12:19 - 00:21:17:24
or attach it to the ground, and then,
cut an opening just big enough for for,


00:21:18:07 - 00:21:22:06
the animal to put its hand through,
and they'd put food in there.


00:21:22:06 - 00:21:25:18
But once the monkey grabbed
it, made a fist grab that food,


00:21:25:23 - 00:21:28:18
it couldn't pull its hand out of a hole.


00:21:28:18 - 00:21:32:23
The only way to escape
it is to relax and let go.


00:21:33:18 - 00:21:35:14
Yeah, is to,


00:21:36:17 - 00:21:38:19
let go of that attachment.


00:21:38:19 - 00:21:39:03
Right.


00:21:39:03 - 00:21:41:14
And to relax is the same thing with that.


00:21:41:14 - 00:21:45:10
You know, the,
the the finger trap, the little woven.


00:21:45:18 - 00:21:47:17
Yeah. If you pull hard, you can't escape.


00:21:47:17 - 00:21:51:14
You have to actually relax your hands
and then slowly remove your fingers.


00:21:51:22 - 00:21:54:01
So same idea.


00:21:54:01 - 00:21:57:01
so how can we, you know,


00:21:57:08 - 00:22:00:08
look at what is entrapping us, right.


00:22:00:19 - 00:22:05:19
so that idea of, you know, that idea of
I've got to have this perfect body or


00:22:05:19 - 00:22:10:19
I have to look like this, or I have to do
that is a very rigid expectation.


00:22:10:19 - 00:22:13:15
We need to relax and learn how to release.


00:22:13:15 - 00:22:14:02
Right?


00:22:14:02 - 00:22:17:02
Because I think imperfection is life.


00:22:17:04 - 00:22:19:12
And I love that.


00:22:19:12 - 00:22:22:13
And I think, you know, I've,
I've dealt with so many people who


00:22:23:11 - 00:22:26:10
and treated
so many people who come in with that


00:22:26:10 - 00:22:29:04
all or nothing perfectionist mindset.


00:22:29:04 - 00:22:30:08
Yeah.


00:22:30:08 - 00:22:32:13
and it's either success or failure.


00:22:32:13 - 00:22:34:14
It's either thin or fat.


00:22:34:14 - 00:22:38:11
It's like one or the other is very binary,
and I love to get them


00:22:38:11 - 00:22:40:15
into what I call the gray.


00:22:40:15 - 00:22:45:17
And the gray area is a place
where they can just see both sides,


00:22:45:17 - 00:22:50:14
not necessarily be striving for one
or the other, or, you know, despairing


00:22:50:14 - 00:22:54:03
about going to the other
and then just learning how to kind of be.


00:22:54:08 - 00:22:57:08
And that's helped so many of my clients,


00:22:57:21 - 00:23:01:24
stop their binge eating in particular,
because it's very one or the other.


00:23:03:02 - 00:23:06:02
But how do you replace an emotion,


00:23:06:05 - 00:23:08:04
right. There are a lot of things
you just can't replace.


00:23:08:04 - 00:23:11:04
We're complex, organic, holistic beings,


00:23:11:05 - 00:23:14:21
unlike a car,
which has a finite number of parts.


00:23:14:21 - 00:23:15:03
And just.


00:23:15:03 - 00:23:16:18
You can swap them out.


00:23:16:18 - 00:23:18:13
Right?
But you can't do that with a human being.


00:23:18:13 - 00:23:23:00
So the the mindfulness is kind of a,
like a, well, I think of as a commitment


00:23:23:00 - 00:23:27:04
and skills approach,
acceptance and commitment and skills.


00:23:27:04 - 00:23:31:06
So you can accept that, you know,
whatever this problem is right now.


00:23:32:21 - 00:23:34:08
is where you're at,


00:23:34:08 - 00:23:38:00
you're dealing with
and you can learn some skills.


00:23:38:21 - 00:23:41:02
And mindfulness is one of the skills
you can learn,


00:23:41:02 - 00:23:44:21
or you can learn other skills
around healthy eating. And,


00:23:46:04 - 00:23:49:04
and it's it's a longer process.


00:23:49:12 - 00:23:52:03
That's the thing about the mechanical
replacement


00:23:52:03 - 00:23:55:03
process is it's quick, right?


00:23:55:19 - 00:23:57:05
And sometimes it works with the body.


00:23:57:05 - 00:24:00:14
You might be able to replace a hip or
a knee or whatever and go through rehab.


00:24:00:14 - 00:24:04:13
But, but for a lot of things
that you're talking about


00:24:04:13 - 00:24:07:13
with mindful
eating and depression, anxiety,


00:24:07:13 - 00:24:10:13
those are that's a process
that people have to go through.


00:24:10:19 - 00:24:13:23
And they have to learn how to tolerate.


00:24:14:05 - 00:24:14:15
Right?


00:24:14:15 - 00:24:17:18
That, that, sometimes a slow process


00:24:17:18 - 00:24:21:04
to heal because we are holistic beings.


00:24:21:15 - 00:24:23:05
Yes, I love that.


00:24:23:05 - 00:24:25:02
That's really powerful.


00:24:25:02 - 00:24:28:23
And I think it just brings
the compassionate part.


00:24:28:23 - 00:24:33:22
And both, you know, as a therapist to,
you know, help them to, you know,


00:24:33:22 - 00:24:38:09
cultivate their own compassion, but
to also have compassion for the process


00:24:38:24 - 00:24:43:16
and that you are going in a direction
that is, toward healing.


00:24:43:24 - 00:24:48:10
And if you can do that
with that relaxation,


00:24:48:10 - 00:24:54:18
the letting go of the expectation
of the perfection, then that gets you


00:24:54:18 - 00:24:58:22
there a lot faster than if you were
fighting and screaming, trying to maintain.


00:24:58:23 - 00:25:02:09
Yeah, that
black and white type of thinking.


00:25:02:24 - 00:25:04:04
Well, we're,


00:25:04:04 - 00:25:05:24
we're so close to out of time,
and I can't believe it,


00:25:05:24 - 00:25:08:07
but I want to talk about your new book.


00:25:08:07 - 00:25:08:20
Tell us.


00:25:08:20 - 00:25:13:04
Oh, it's coming out soon, and we want to
know, and we want to buy it and read it.


00:25:14:18 - 00:25:17:15
It's called simply Mindful Meal by Meal.


00:25:17:15 - 00:25:20:11
And it's 101 mindful ways to


00:25:20:11 - 00:25:23:14
to create
a healthy relationship with food.


00:25:24:04 - 00:25:27:04
And so it's yeah, these are


00:25:27:22 - 00:25:31:09
they're they each page starts with a quote


00:25:32:06 - 00:25:35:06
and then a commentary
that you're dealing with


00:25:35:09 - 00:25:38:06
and then, a one page meditation.


00:25:38:06 - 00:25:41:06
So, two pages,
you get the complete training,


00:25:41:12 - 00:25:44:11
for each one of these hundred
and one practices.


00:25:44:11 - 00:25:48:03
And the thing about it
that I wanted to do with this book was to,


00:25:48:20 - 00:25:53:01
I also I bring people into the what
I call the four step food journey.


00:25:53:01 - 00:25:55:04
So the book is divided into four parts.


00:25:55:04 - 00:25:58:19
First part, when you think about it,
is entry into the meal.


00:25:59:06 - 00:26:00:02
How are you feeling?


00:26:00:02 - 00:26:01:24
What are your emotions
when you come to the meal?


00:26:01:24 - 00:26:04:07
What are you feeling?
What is your hunger level?


00:26:04:07 - 00:26:07:13
And so that's all that kind of teaching
and training around


00:26:07:18 - 00:26:10:18
making people aware of entry
into the meal.


00:26:10:19 - 00:26:11:01
Right?


00:26:11:01 - 00:26:11:23
Because of


00:26:11:23 - 00:26:13:13
because if you're angry
when you're entering,


00:26:13:13 - 00:26:15:18
you're going to you're going to eat anger,
right?


00:26:15:18 - 00:26:17:22
You're going to you're going to eat fast.
You're going to do something.


00:26:17:22 - 00:26:20:04
It's not really, or or you might,


00:26:21:05 - 00:26:23:11
just if you're hungry, if


00:26:23:11 - 00:26:26:12
you're excessively hungry, you might order
the wrong kind of food just to,


00:26:27:08 - 00:26:30:16
you know, because you're not in a place
of moderate hunger


00:26:30:16 - 00:26:34:15
where you can more, carefully assess
what the body needs.


00:26:34:22 - 00:26:36:08
Totally. Yeah.


00:26:36:08 - 00:26:39:09
And then the second part, is preparation.


00:26:39:09 - 00:26:41:02
So preparation


00:26:41:02 - 00:26:44:18
could be a lot of things from how do you
prepare your space for the meal?


00:26:44:19 - 00:26:47:06
How do you prepare the foods
that you're going to eat?


00:26:47:06 - 00:26:50:06
Which foods are you
are you deciding to eat.


00:26:50:12 - 00:26:51:05
Right.


00:26:51:05 - 00:26:54:08
And so, you know, even going
shopping as a preparation,


00:26:55:03 - 00:26:57:16
part of your preparation practice and,


00:26:57:16 - 00:27:01:10
retail food stores there are a lot of things


00:27:01:10 - 00:27:05:03
that you don't know about, about their
how they’re trying to shape your behavior.


00:27:05:13 - 00:27:08:15
And so I talk about some of those things
in the book too, to help people


00:27:08:16 - 00:27:12:15
become more aware or know mindfulness
is all about increasing your awareness.


00:27:13:08 - 00:27:16:00
you know, your, your, and your,


00:27:16:00 - 00:27:18:21
your mindfulness quotient, your MQ


00:27:19:23 - 00:27:20:16
and then,


00:27:20:16 - 00:27:24:06
and then there's the eating part,
which is the third part of the book.


00:27:24:17 - 00:27:27:15
And so with the eating part,
that's not just the eating the food,


00:27:27:15 - 00:27:29:00
but it's also about community.


00:27:29:00 - 00:27:32:00
It's about recognition
that every food stuff,


00:27:32:13 - 00:27:35:10
brings in a complete community.


00:27:35:10 - 00:27:36:19
Right.


00:27:36:19 - 00:27:40:21
And so there's a,
a, a lot of practices in there,


00:27:41:05 - 00:27:44:15
not just about specifically eating,
but about recognition


00:27:44:15 - 00:27:49:12
of how to relate to others
and sharing and giving.


00:27:49:23 - 00:27:51:17
So it's. Yeah.


00:27:51:17 - 00:27:55:18
And then the last part is,
is transitioning out of the meal,


00:27:56:12 - 00:27:59:07
right as is exiting the meal.


00:27:59:07 - 00:28:01:01
And so I've found a lot of people didn't.


00:28:01:01 - 00:28:04:10
And this was my case
maybe when I was younger and


00:28:05:16 - 00:28:08:22
was dealing with food issues was that
I didn't know when the meal ended.


00:28:09:11 - 00:28:12:06
And so I might keep eating or I might


00:28:12:06 - 00:28:14:15
It's time, you know,
how can I leave that last meal


00:28:14:15 - 00:28:17:24
with a sense of grace,
knowing that I've sated, I've had enough


00:28:18:10 - 00:28:21:11
and that I can move on to the next thing
now, right?


00:28:22:07 - 00:28:23:00
Yeah.


00:28:23:00 - 00:28:28:01
So those are the four, steps, the calling,
the four step food journey.


00:28:28:01 - 00:28:30:06
And that's how the books are organized.


00:28:30:06 - 00:28:33:10
And again, it's very experiential. And,


00:28:34:20 - 00:28:36:11
I think


00:28:36:11 - 00:28:39:05
and, and anybody can use the book
how they want.


00:28:39:05 - 00:28:41:17
You could use it,
you know, randomly open up


00:28:41:17 - 00:28:44:15
and let the universe be your guide
as to what I'm supposed to learn


00:28:44:15 - 00:28:50:09
now, you could, go through a
particular section at a time.


00:28:51:23 - 00:28:52:13
You could look at


00:28:52:13 - 00:28:55:13
the different headings
and different titles or the chapters


00:28:55:13 - 00:28:59:00
which describe what it's about, and just
pick out what you need in this moment.


00:28:59:08 - 00:29:02:08
So a lot of different ways
to use the book.


00:29:03:18 - 00:29:07:20
I think it's really valuable
to have those four steps,


00:29:07:20 - 00:29:09:11
because a person might come in


00:29:09:11 - 00:29:13:01
and realize they have the major problem
with step four.


00:29:13:09 - 00:29:15:02
I don't know when the meal's over.


00:29:15:02 - 00:29:19:00
Oh, maybe it's because I didn't do one,
two and three first.


00:29:19:00 - 00:29:23:21
I didn't really, you know,
you know, enter into the thinking, like


00:29:24:08 - 00:29:29:06
deciding for myself, listening to my body,
my actually hungry, or am I too hungry?


00:29:29:10 - 00:29:33:15
I didn't take enough time
to, like, really think about the food


00:29:33:15 - 00:29:36:20
that I'm getting and,
you know, all of the other things


00:29:36:20 - 00:29:39:20
that you need to do to know
when the actual meal is over.


00:29:39:20 - 00:29:42:08
Sometimes we just move so fast.


00:29:42:08 - 00:29:43:20
And oh yeah. We eat so fast.


00:29:43:20 - 00:29:45:08
And we know that it takes 20 minutes


00:29:45:08 - 00:29:48:24
for the mind to register
the presence of food in your belly.


00:29:48:24 - 00:29:51:11
So you do need to go slower.


00:29:51:11 - 00:29:54:16
and we're just not conditioned
to do that in this culture.


00:29:54:16 - 00:29:56:22
And so many people are eating in their cars


00:29:56:22 - 00:29:58:23
And I'm like, oh, don't do that.


00:29:58:23 - 00:30:02:06
See you seeing them eating at their desk
in front of their computer.


00:30:02:06 - 00:30:02:18
And like,


00:30:02:18 - 00:30:05:20
I think it's a shame that even in schools
that they've tried to limit


00:30:05:20 - 00:30:09:12
the amount of time that kids have to eat
to maybe 15 minutes in some schools.


00:30:09:24 - 00:30:13:10
And I just think that's doing a disservice
to people and making food


00:30:13:10 - 00:30:15:00
like a it's not important.


00:30:15:00 - 00:30:16:16
Right. What's the message?


00:30:16:16 - 00:30:18:23
Oh it's just yeah.


00:30:18:23 - 00:30:21:09
Yeah. You go to France
and it's completely different.


00:30:21:09 - 00:30:23:18
They'll spend all day on a meal, practically.


00:30:23:18 - 00:30:26:18
Yes, yes. Sign me up for that.


00:30:26:18 - 00:30:28:23
Oh the. Heaven.


00:30:28:23 - 00:30:31:07
I was like,
oh my gosh, can we have more of this?


00:30:31:07 - 00:30:33:16
I can do this all day. And you can really in France.


00:30:34:20 - 00:30:36:15
Donald, we're out of time. I can’t even believe this.


00:30:36:15 - 00:30:37:20
Oh, no. Well.


00:30:37:20 - 00:30:40:11
Tell people how they can get ahold of you.


00:30:40:11 - 00:30:43:15
Tell them when the book is going
to come out and how they can order it.


00:30:44:05 - 00:30:48:06
We can go to my website,
which is Mindfulpractices.com.


00:30:48:06 - 00:30:52:01
It's mindfulpractices.com.


00:30:52:12 - 00:30:53:07
Okay.


00:30:53:07 - 00:30:56:08
and you can contact me
through that website or my email


00:30:56:08 - 00:30:59:18
is info@mindfulpractices.com.


00:31:00:02 - 00:31:03:02
And the book is going to be
on all the Amazon


00:31:03:12 - 00:31:07:17
sites in different, countries,
wherever you happen to be located.


00:31:08:00 - 00:31:10:07
And that's
probably the best way to, to get it.


00:31:10:07 - 00:31:13:19
And then that's part of the mindful,
the mindful Simply


00:31:13:19 - 00:31:15:12
Mindful book series, actually.


00:31:15:12 - 00:31:17:17
So this is the fourth in that series.


00:31:17:17 - 00:31:18:13
So take a look.


00:31:18:13 - 00:31:20:22
You might find some of the others
interesting to you.


00:31:20:22 - 00:31:23:24
The actually I have one here
simply mindful


00:31:23:24 - 00:31:26:24
was the first book,
and this is actually a mindful,


00:31:27:11 - 00:31:31:08
a self contained mindfulness course
and a handbook for mindful living.


00:31:31:08 - 00:31:33:11
So if you're not familiar
with mindfulness,


00:31:33:11 - 00:31:36:02
kind of of to go and start
from the beginning and,


00:31:36:02 - 00:31:39:02
and learn about it,
that that would be a good way to do that.


00:31:39:08 - 00:31:40:22
Okay.


00:31:40:22 - 00:31:45:08
And you are just one of the kindest,
most accessible people.


00:31:45:08 - 00:31:49:10
I mean, you just are really  compassionate and open-hearted. Thank you.


00:31:49:13 - 00:31:55:04
And I am so incredibly grateful for
the help that you've given me on my book.


00:31:55:04 - 00:31:59:06
And I really hope the help I'm giving you
is helpful for your book.


00:31:59:15 - 00:32:02:23
You are absolutely just this


00:32:03:03 - 00:32:06:20
bright, shining light and I am so grateful. Oh that’s very kind.


00:32:07:14 - 00:32:09:20
I hope that you can stay in my life
forever.


00:32:09:20 - 00:32:12:00
That's my hope.
I really do feel connected to you.


00:32:12:00 - 00:32:15:11
Well, I feel, very fortunate that we did
connect


00:32:15:11 - 00:32:18:11
Supatra. Thank you. Yeah. Okay.


00:32:18:17 - 00:32:22:19
I will definitely have
to have you back on the show another time,


00:32:22:19 - 00:32:28:01
because you just are a wealth of wisdom
and I know that you know, you're the,


00:32:28:03 - 00:32:33:13
you know, practical application
of mindfulness can be so helpful to anyone


00:32:33:13 - 00:32:36:19
who's struggling with eating disorders
or disordered eating,


00:32:36:19 - 00:32:40:10
but really just anything
depression, anxiety, anything.


00:32:40:17 - 00:32:42:24
Yeah. So valuable what you're teaching.


00:32:42:24 - 00:32:45:24
And we're just so lucky
you're out here doing that.


00:32:46:01 - 00:32:48:11
Well, thank you and bless you
for the work you're doing. And,


00:32:50:00 - 00:32:52:19
yeah, our books would make nice bookends.


00:32:52:19 - 00:32:53:14
I know, I.


00:32:53:14 - 00:32:56:10
Love it, they go hand in hand
and it's beautiful, you know.


00:32:56:10 - 00:32:56:21
Okay.


00:32:56:21 - 00:33:00:05
Well thank you
everyone for joining in on this amazing


00:33:00:05 - 00:33:03:09
conversation with mindfulness
guru Donald Altman.


00:33:03:09 - 00:33:07:13
We are so blessed and lucky to have him
and we're going to get him back,


00:33:07:13 - 00:33:08:20
I promise you.


00:33:08:20 - 00:33:09:17
Thank you so much.


00:33:09:17 - 00:33:13:22
We will look forward to seeing you
with our next exciting interview,


00:33:13:22 - 00:33:16:14
and we really hope you join us.


00:33:17:13 - 00:33:21:11
Thanks for tuning into the ANEW Body Insight podcast.


00:33:21:18 - 00:33:25:05
Please remember, the content shared on this podcast is for entertainment


00:33:25:05 - 00:33:28:07
purposes only and does not constitute medical advice.


00:33:28:17 - 00:33:29:19
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00:33:29:19 - 00:33:33:21
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00:33:34:01 - 00:33:36:01
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00:33:36:01 - 00:33:38:17
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00:33:38:17 - 00:33:42:07
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